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Post Info TOPIC: 2013-14 NFL Talk


Negus

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well that was fast...

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/11020969/new-york-giants-waive-suspended-safety-hill



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Young Money

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this is the same guy with the crazy twitter account in college right?

gordon caught speeding 74 in a 60 with pot in the car over the weekend. i can understand making one big mistake that messes up your career but getting caught over and over again for the same thing especially when the one year suspension is longer than ray rice will get for knocking out his fiancee cold might be the dumbest way possible to ruin a career.

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Negus

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ya will hill had that crazy twitter it was great:

http://deadspin.com/5743250/will-hill-would-like-everyone-to-know-he-does-not-go-harder-than-a-russian-****-in-airports-etc



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Negus

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this article is funny/crazy/scary all at the same time.  about the 2009 flordia gators.  this team was loaded, and also should of had percy harvin and cam newton on the roster...

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/2009-florida-gators-had-talent--but-boy--they-also-had-busts--shaky-characters-165928960.html



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Young Money

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i cant imagine the parties they threw. pouncey twins as bouncers kicking out the nerdy kids, cooper as the DJ playing only kenny chesney, jenkins and spikes hotboxing the garage, rainey running around threating all the women with a good time, people staying faaaar away from hernandez to make sure they dont spill his drinks, jordan reed at the school nurse with some kind of injury, gilbert looking lost as usual...

and tim tebow in his dorm room praying and studying his playbook.



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Negus

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don't forget will hill live tweeting the whole thing!

cant wait for the 10 year reunion



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Negus

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please read this article if you want to understand how hard it is to stop the eagles offense.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2091113-chip-kellys-offense-presents-biggest-challenge-to-nfl-defensive-coordinators

gimmick offense SMH, try hardest offense in the NFL to stop.  anyone who thinks defenses will "figure out" chips offense simply because there is now an off season and film on it is an idiot.  comparing the skins downfall or the fact the 49ers stopped running the read option as much and comparing that to what the eagles actually do and run shows me certain ppl (mainly skins fans) have no idea whats they are talking about.



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Young Money

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whats nick foles next contract gonna look like? is he a $100m QB or does the eagles offense make him look better than he is?



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Negus

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does it matter? is richard sherman worth 50mil guaranteed (or whatever he got) or does him playing in seattles cover 3 along with earl thomas and chancelor make him look better than he is?  whatever the answer is, it doesn't matter because that's the system they play in.

if foles gets over 100 mil in his next contract it means he either just won the super bowl or came damn close.  so either way i'll take it!

 



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Young Money

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i honestly believe sherman is the best CB in the league. if you listen to his on field mic'ed up stuff especially on the practice field, dude is as smart as peyton manning when it comes to football.

im not sure foles is worth $100m even if he gets to the NFCC game. is he much better than barkley in that system? wouldnt you rather spend that $90 difference elsewhere?

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Report I read recently is Barkley is getting out played in OTA's by whoever the 3rd guy is .... I mean it is just OTAs but still

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Negus

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who says foles is even going to get 100 mil?  cuz kaepernick "got it?"  and i use quotes because his deal was reported as a 120mil deal but once people dissected it they realized it was more of a year to year deal, so if he has 2 terrible years upcoming and his ass gets cut, its not a 100 mil deal anymore. 

idk why your so worried about this, hes literally not even eligible for a new deal until after this year, he might have to wait 2 years before eagles even offer him anything anyway.  eagles GM howie roseman is smart enough to not throw a huge deal and one that will hamper the team long term, so lets wait to see how this plays out.  

and yes foles is 10x better than barkely.  i dont put much into OTA's either, but reports are hes struggling while foles has looked great.  i do put stock into game tape where barkley lead this offense to about 3 points vs a game and a half vs the '86 bears i mean dallas/nyg defense last year. 



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Young Money

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because you keep saying chip kelly doesnt run a "gimmick" offense, but if the QB (the most important position on the field) cant be considered a top QB when they are scoring the most points in the league Id say thats the definition of a gimmick offense

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Young Money

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unless theyre the best power running football team in the history of the league, which they are not.

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Negus

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6ixty wrote:

because you keep saying chip kelly doesnt run a "gimmick" offense, but if the QB (the most important position on the field) cant be considered a top QB when they are scoring the most points in the league Id say thats the definition of a gimmick offense


SMH.  ok you baited me into a rant time, luckily for me i have a ton of free time on my hands.  

1st of all, foles only just finished his 2nd year, if he has another dominate year, you don't think people are going to consider him a top 10 qb?  also, there's no proof (yet) that any qb can be successful in this offense.  vick put up decent numbers but was 1-3 before he was injured and barkley put up 3 points as i mentioned earlier which diminishes your main point of why this is a gimmick.  regardless, just because an offense makes one position seem very successful no matter who does it, that doesn't make it a gimmick. when the broncos back with mike shannahan had a 1,000 yard rusher every year drafting 6th rounders does that mean he ran a gimmick offense because he had a system that allowed a certain type of RB to be very successful? i guess those back to back super bowl teams had gimmick offenses cuz terrell davis wasn't a high draft pick.

the main thing that frustrates me when you say **** like this is because i actually think you know football, but yet you don't understand what the work "gimmick" means.  gimmick means a team only does one thing, such as when the dolphins ran the wild cat over and over again, that is a gimmick.  gimmicks also come to an end, which then teams don't run anymore, so by you calling the eagles offense a gimmick means you think teams are going to figure them out after a season of watching film (something i've heard many skins fans say) and then the eagles are going to have to go back to a traditional west coast offense or whatever else teams run.  that is not happening and here is why:  

what the eagles run is considered an "offense."  in fact, they run a spread offense with a lot of west coast principles (as explained in the previous article you probably didn't read) and while you might consider this a "gimmick" most teams call it a "hurry up offense." The goal is to run a play and get back to the line of scrimmage as quickly as possible to then try to run the next play as fast as possible without allowing the defense to line up.  the goal of them not being lined up properly is not to try to draw a cheap offside (which would be a gimmick) but more so to 1. tire them out and 2. to confuse them and not allow defenses the time to dissect their play formation and give them a hint to what play they might run next. the less time they have to call their play or figure out yours the better chances you have of gaining yards. successful teams such as the broncos and patriots try to do this as well, in fact there was even an article a year or 2 ago about how tom brady just calls 1 word out and every player knows what play it is which is something similar to what chip has done for years.    

the article also explained how the eagles run multiple versions of "packaged plays" which means there is more than one option on each play depending on how the defense reacts.  so for example, the eagles could run a read sweep option with a bubble screen going the opposite way so if the linebacker crashes to mccoy on the sweep, foles can pull the ball and throw it to the wr screen where the offense has a 3 x 2 advantage.  if this is what you consider an offense that consistently is able to find the weak side of the defense a "gimmick" then i guess you are right and teams will be able to figure out the eagles offense after this year and we're in trouble.  guess we will have our answer next year, and if the eagles are in the top 5 in scoring again we will know who was right.



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Young Money

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haha thats a solid comeback. one i dont have a rebuttal for. except to make it clear that i dont look at the offense as a gimmick in the sense that it runs one type of play (like the phins running the wildcat) but one that would rather confuse the defense or force them into a defense that they dont want to be in (like the phins running the wildcat) rather than relying on the talent of the players on offense.

my point this whole time is that most of the players on the eagles offense are interchangable. just look at djax. one of the best WR in the league was RELEASED because he can easily be replaced. a couple months ago you came at me with foles > ben. you think foles would put up ben numbers on the steelers? i dont. chip kelly has a fantastic offensive philosophy and it obviously worked in the NFL last season. but how many times did the eagles run anything that looked like a conventional offense?

tricking the defense rather than beating them = gimmick. and i wouldnt be so fast to think that it wont be figured out like the wildcat and the read option

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Young Money

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also, frustrating you to the point of rants is my sole purpose in life haha.

i like what chip kellys done but to think the eagles offense is made up of the best 11-player unit in the league is where we disagree

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Negus

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if you think what the eagles are doing is tricking the defense then idk what to tell you (or why that is a bad thing if you can do it consistently).  every team game plans and tries to find weakness and then take advantage of that.  peyton does the same thing when he calls all his audibles/motions pre-snap, he is just trying to find out what the coverage the d is in and who is being covered one on one and that is where he finds the d's weakness.  eagles do it during the play by doing a "read" and see how a specific player on d reacts and then go the opposite way aka the weakness.  pats also did the same thing with hernandez and gronk and running the hurry up.  if the d was in a 4-3 they passed every time and had a mismatch with a LB on one of their faster TE's.  if the d was in nickle they ran and had their TE's blocking a corner.  is that not "forceing them into a defense that they dont want to be in?" (your words).  you will come to my side after drafting 3 eagles in fantasy next year and cheering for points/yards.

i also think you're undervaluing a lot of players on the eagles offense. to start, we got mccoy who is a top 3 back in the entire NFL and maybe the best possible fit for how the eagles play.  then we got the eagles oline which is one of, if not the, best in the NFL and them playing every single game together last year gave them a serious advantage over most of the league.  just look at how the steelers struggled early last year when pouncey and a few others got hurt.  peters is considered the best LT in the league, evan mathis the best guard and jason kelce one of the best centers.  that's 4 players right there who are top 5 for their position.  and finally foles.  he's not a top 10 qb yet, but like i said, if he has another dominate year and puts up huge numbers its going to be hard to argue against him.  is it September yet?

 

 



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Young Money

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HERE WE GO!!

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/06/12/steelers-extend-maurkice-pouncey-by-five-years/

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Negus

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jon beason carted off the field today in practice.

even tho hes a giant, lets hope its not too serious



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Ugh, I never really wish for injuries to guys (except for Vick, idk why)

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Young Money

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falcon on hark knocks. not a bad choice

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View image on Twitter



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Falcons announced as this years Hard Knocks team.

My guesses at story lines:

1)Julio's recovery
2)Roddy White as the elder statesman
3)Matt Ryan getting his mojo back
4)Is Sjax done?
5) Welcome to ATL Jake Mathews.



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Young Money

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that sound you hear is brandon flowers plane touching down at Pittsburgh international

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Texans, mark it down, put it on the board.

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Young Money

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ill say falcons

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totally forgot how good the jets RBs were last year. they might have rotated too much to be a weekly fantasy start but ivory, powel and richardson were good overall. add in CJ2k (who didnt have a bad year himself) plus decker and mike vick and i could see the jets making a turnaround next year. still early but jets, bucs and maybe the phins are early picks for turnaround seasons.

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Vick aint gonna get much play this year, thats my belief.

It all falls on Geno's shoulders.

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What are the big questions for your team this year going into the pre-season?

For the Giants...

Backup QB: Can Ryan Nassib establish himself this summer?

Wide Receiver: Do the Giants really have the goods? (VC, Randle, Beckham, Odell, is it enough?)

Running Back: The new era begins. (Rashad Jennings/Andre Williams)

Defensive End: Is JPP back? And how far has Damontre come since last season?

Offensive Line: Is Chris Snee back? And how good are the new faces?

Linebacker: With no Beason, can the rookie Kennard show he’s a draft steal?

DBs: Who will emerge as the star out of Jerry Reese’s vast signings (CB:Prince/DRC/WT3/Bowman/McBride)(S:Rolle/Brown/Taylor/Demps/Berle)?

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Young Money

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for the steelers its all about the new guys...

 

safety -- how will the steelers prize of free agency mike mitchell take over for ryan clark. mitchell runs a sub 4.4, I think clark runs about a 6.4 these days so the speed is a (needed) upgrade. clark could lay the wood but mitchell is known for his hits as well. mitchell topped clark in sacks, ints, pass breakups and tackles last season. hes def an upgrade as a player, but clark was smart, knew the defense, and most importantly knew exactly where Polamalu would be at all times.

DE -- stephon tuitt was considered by some as a first rounder who fell to the second. hopefully he can step in across from wreck it heyward and the DE position will be an upgrade over ziggy hood from last year. Cam thomas was brought in from SD as well.

NT -- mcclendon is entrenched but how much can 6'7 350 lb danny mccullers get in there and push people around?

ILB -- shazier has gotten some glowing reports from football in shorts. he was even covering AB one OTA. the steelers are mad deep at ILB right now with timmons, shazier, last years starter vince williams and FINALLY healthy 3rd round pick who never played a snap his first 2 years after a devistating injury, sean spence. im excited how this will play out. athur moats will be both inside and out.

OLD -- worilds exploded last season and jarvis got better as the season went on. these guys could be a problem for opposing QBs

steelers defense has 3 player on the entire defensive roster over the age of 28. no longer are they old or slow!

 

on offense the RB position is greatly improved. Le'Backfield -- Le'Veon Bell and LeGarette Blount to go along with the fastest man in the draft Dri Archer soundd much better than an injured Bell, issaac redman, jon dwyer and felix jones

WR -- from an outsiders perspective the WR position looks thin but when you get into it it could be a strength. last years injured 3rd rounder markus wheaton is back on a tear, lance moore is equivelant to cotchery, this years 4th rounder martaveus bryant is going to be a beast, DHB may get bounced in favor of the steelers secret weapon, the other Brown -- second year man justin brown. most are unproven but if they live up to their potential AB - Wheaton - Bryant - Brown with Archer coming out of the backfield can be a good YOUNG WR corps.

heath millers coming back from injury and should be better this year. the oline will (better) be significantly better under munchuck who may be this seasons best FA pickup.

 

im suuuuper pumped about this steelers team. they have gotten better in almost all areas from last year.

78 days until kickoff!!!!



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NFL suspended Eagles RT Lane Johnson four games for violating the league's policy against performance-enhancing drugs.


CHEATIN PHILLY!

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Young Money

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smh what is chip putting in those smoothies?!

also, fish, your presence on the forum has never been higher since you started this new job!!

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Negus

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ya def not good, 2nd player suspended this offseason (jake knott, back up LB) but still not a good look.  you esp don't want to hear its a form of steroids from a young player who, you know, was a lot smaller and used to be a QB/TE and is now your starting RT. 

it also sucks cuz the eagles 5 oline starters played every single game last year and having that familiarity is big and one of the main reasons why the offense performed so well last year.  they did re-sign one of their backups to an extension who they like, so hopefully he can step in and with the entire training camp to prepare for it hopefully means the o won't miss a beat.



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Young Money

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10. Charles
9. AP
8. Quinn
7. Sherman
6. Watt
5. Megatron
4. Brees
3. Rodgers
2. Brady
1. Manning

My wayyyy too fast top 10. personally i think if QBs are good enough to be top 10 (rodgers got screwed) then they should be in the top 5. my only one i even question is quinn over earl thomas or robert mathis. i dont see AJ green as a top 10 player, i dont see TE as a top 10 position (graham) and i cant believe 3 RBs were in the top 10 in todays NFL.



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Young Money

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i like kuechley too

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Negus

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very good top 10, hard to disagree too much.  like I said last night, the players 100 has no voting criteria at all.  some players think its who had the best season in 2013 (even though its called top 100 players of 2014) while others think its more of a who would you want going into next year.  with that said, if I had to vote on my top 10 here is what I would do:

note: my voting critera is like madden.  who would be the highest ranked player in my mind and any tie would be broken based off importance of position (ex: qb > wr).  here we go:

10. Richard Sherman

9. Patrick Peterson

8. Joe Thomas

7. AP

6. Quinn

5. Brady

4. JJ Watt

3. Calvin Johnson

2. A. Rodgers

1. Manning

*Note #2.  all these guys would be a 95 or 96 in Fish Madden 2014 so some really good players are left out of this left such as Drew Breese, Shady McCoy, Nick Foles etc.

Now if we were doing a top 10 based off of importance the top 5 would be all QB's but that would be no fun



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Negus

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how about josh Gordon?  talk about throwing away a career.  not only is he currently facing a lengthy suspension but now he goes and gets arrested for a DWI.  and who was he with?  the #1 riskiest character pick in the NBA draft, pj harrision who you know was just kicked out of college for getting in too much trouble and riding in cars with known drug dealers.  Gordon needs to seriously evaluate who his friends are going forward if he wants a successful NFL career.

 



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Such an ass. Aside from my Fantasy Football implications that dude was so much fun to watch. I was really getting into the idea of watching Manziel throw to him. Ugh what a waste.

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Young Money

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as a steeelers fan im not dissapointed in josh gordons actions

as an NFL fan, its hard not to feel for the guy on and off the field.

it just amazes me that thes guys can get in so much trouble. i was blacked out for 4 straight days in one of the most policed places in america this weekend didnt get myself into a single bit of trouble. its not like driving a car is garnering attention, unless hes driving a ferrari testarosta hes got the same chances as anyone else of getting pulled over.

manziel on the other hand is dumb as rocks if what hes doing in that pic from vegas is what hes doing in that pic. hes lucky there were no drugs visible in the picture.

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not sure why but this is hilarious to me. especially the part about the third guy punching a HS kid during a pickup basketball game this weekend haha

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/07/10/grocery-list-milk-bread-swap-cars-with-josh-gordon/

ill never understand rich people

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Yeah that definitely got a Dah Fuh moment outta me.

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woooooo ur boy made the clayton mailbag for the second time!!

Q: Wouldn't an easy and effective solution to the tight end/wide receiver situation be to set aside a smaller set of jersey numbers for TEs? That will force them to decide before a season -- or really, a career -- whether they are a TE or WR. Then, when someone such as Jimmy Graham, who would be forced to wear, say, a number between 76-82 is assigned a franchise tag, it would be assigned to the number, not the player. This could also work for offensive tackles versus guards. Just divide the numbers allowed for O-linemen further into position brackets.

Nick in Washington, D.C.

A: This isn't a number issue. It's a collective bargaining issue. The players association would have to work out a deal with the NFL on reclassifying the tight end position. The Graham grievance brought up a valid point. The receivers who work the outside make the big bucks. The slot guys make less. If a tight end is in the slot, what does that mean? Halfbacks also line up in the slot. If the union and the owners can agree on a solution, they could make the uniform numbers work.

 

 

Just call me the commish, im out here getting **** DONE

 



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eagles ranked #13 on PFT? I actually think thats a little low and they should certainly be ahead of the ravens. but this dude had a differnt opinion which made me think...


craigmaitland says:

What a joke.. Look at some of the circus act of wins the fluke Eagles had last year.
-Beat RG3 on his first game back
-Beat the awful bucs
-Beat the Raiders with Pryor at QB.
-Beat the Scott Tolzien lead Packers.
-Beat awful Skins again (lead by Desean again).
-Beat the Cardinals in the worst officiated game of the season.
-Beat the most Pass happy offense in the NFL in a snowstorm.
-Beat Dallas with Kyle Orton.




sure you can only play who you play, but these wins make them look a little weaker. what you think fish? are they what last years record says they are?

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you can nitpick almost any teams schedule.  if you wanna do that for the wins how about you (pft commenter) mention 5 of their 6 losses came with Vick/Barkley as the starter or Foles being hurt.  bottom line, they finished the season 7-1 and then lost in the playoffs to the saints on a last second FG, I think that's pretty good no matter how you cut it. 

this year the schedule is much tougher, facing the NFC West and then having a 1st place schedule.  Luckily all of the NFC east faces the West so we all are going to have some tough games, hopefully we can split in the west and do work in division and come out as nfc east champs again and hope to get some favorable matchups in the playoffs. 

eagles should be improved this year.  I know everyone wants to hope desean Jackson is this major loss but with maclin back and sproles in, it really isn't.  plus this is not only year 2 in chip kellys offense it is also year 2 in the 3-4 for the defense which should make some big improvements.  I don't know of too many systems where year 1 was successful and then year 2 went downhill.  most of the eagles main guys on defense are probably dudes you never heard of, but they are all home grown players such as cox, boykins, kendricks, curry all going into year 3 which hopefully will be big improvements for all of them.  this isn't the same 32nd ranked d as the past few years and with this offense coming back eagles should be one of the better teams in the NFC this year.

 

 

 

   



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-Mark Fischer Inc.



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Challenge!

How many Eagles D players can i name without looking, and how many can you name on the Giants fish?

Trent Cole
Fletcher Cox
Bennie Logan
Mychal Kendricks
Brandon Boykin
Malcolm Jenkins
Nate Allen
Conner Barwin
Cary Williams
Brandon "We traded up for this guy?" Graham



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Negus

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pretty good.  it's not madden season so this might be hard for me plus giants just signed half their team in FA this offseason so ill give it a shot:

JPP

Mathius Kiwa something

Antrel Rolle

DRC

Thurman

Prince

Mark Herlizck

Mike Patterson

Cullen Jenkins

I probably misspelled most of their names but not bad!

 



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Not bad at all!

DE: Robert Ayers, JPP, Kiwanuka, Damontre Moore

DT: John Hankins, Cullen Jenkins, Mike Patterson, Markus Kuhn, Jay Bromley(R)

LB: Jameel McClain, Jon Beason, Spencer Paysinger, Jaquain Williams

CB: DRC, Prince, WT3, Trumaine McBride, Zack Bowman

S: Rolle, Stevie Brown, Cooper Taylor, Quentin Demps


Theres a few more, but they're fringy guys.

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Negus

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beason and stevie brown, should knew those 2.

whats the deal with beason, didn't he get hurt during OTAs?  I'm guessing nothing serious?



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Week 1 questionable, definitely back by week 2

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